Are some coins too pricey to make?
Canada recently stopped producing pennies, and there's a bill before Congress to make US pennies and nickels out of steel to cut costs.
Those nickels hiding in your sofas and purses are pricey, too. It cost roughly 11.2 cents to make one U.S. nickel -- like the penny, more than double the coin's face value.
Critics suggest it's time for the Mint to start pinching its pennies. A bill before Congress would mandate a switch to a cheaper metal -- steel -- for pennies and nickels.
And that bill doesn't go far enough for some critics. They'd like to see the U.S. scrap pennies altogether, as Canada decided to do last week. Canadian pennies had been costing the government 1.6 cents each to produce. (Read "Canada kills its penny.")
Other U.S. coins are cheaper in comparison to their face values. For fiscal 2011, production costs per coin were:
- Dime, 5.7 cents.
- Quarter, 11.1 cents.
The Best Counterfeits In The World. Period.
- Dollar, 18.0 cents.
Do you have pre-1983 copper pennies in your change jar at home? The metal in those coins is worth about twice their face value, which is why today's pennies are only copper-plated.
But don't get any ideas about melting down your loose change. The Mint says that's illegal, and the penalty can be as high as five years in prison and a fine of $10,000 (that's 1 million pennies).
Ironically, these symbols of America are made from non-American materials. The imported metals are one reason the coins are expensive to produce, says U.S. Rep. Steve Stivers, R-Ohio, who introduced the bill to switch to steel coins. The Obama administration, meanwhile, has asked Congress to give the Mint the flexibility to use cheaper materials.
If Congress does act, it could save U.S. taxpayers plenty.
"We could save taxpayers an estimated $433 million over 10 years in production if we moved to using steel instead of nickel and copper in nickels and pennies," Stivers says. "Plus, the U.S. could see a $4 billion profit from recovering the nickel, zinc and copper from old coins currently in circulation."
Canada's Royal Canadian Mint already has made the switch to steel. Most Canadian coins have been more than 90% steel since 2000.
William Butler Yeats' fans need not worry: His beloved brown penny would still look the same.
"We could dip pennies made of steel in copper to mimic the current look," Stivers says. And there "wouldn't be a noticeable difference in the look of the nickel."
But not everyone is sold on steel. Stivers and Robert Whaples, a Wake Forest University economics professor who has published papers about the nation's costly coins, say the vending-machine industry isn't buying the change.
"Some vending machines still take nickels. And because the machines' technology measures coins based on weight, vending machines would have to upgrade their technology to adjust to the change in weight of a steel nickel," Whaples says. "But those costs would be minimal compared to the savings of switching to steel."
Getting rid of the penny would be an even better move, Whaples says.
97Comments
4 minutes ago
I visited Australia last Sept. and had a wonderful two week stay. Among other things, I learned about their currency and coinage. Down Under the penny is long since history, it is no more. Canada belatedly is going the same route. Australia has a system of rounding up or down to the next 5 cents in price that is done automatically at check out. In a technologically advanced consumer culture, nobody gives it a second thought. Canada will replicate their system.
Australia also abolished the $1 dollar bill, which was costly to taxpayers because paper wears out rapidly. Instead, they have a $1 dollar coin that is thicker than smaller denomination coins, and is a gold color. Unlike the US Anthony and Sacajawea dollar coins, the Australian dollar coin is easy to identify by sight and feel. Australia also has a $2 dollar coin that similarly is thicker and is a gold color, and is a different diameter to differentiate it from the $1 dollar coin.
Their system works fine, is efficient, saves the taxpayers minting costs, and is easy to use. Let's go, America.
Australia also abolished the $1 dollar bill, which was costly to taxpayers because paper wears out rapidly. Instead, they have a $1 dollar coin that is thicker than smaller denomination coins, and is a gold color. Unlike the US Anthony and Sacajawea dollar coins, the Australian dollar coin is easy to identify by sight and feel. Australia also has a $2 dollar coin that similarly is thicker and is a gold color, and is a different diameter to differentiate it from the $1 dollar coin.
Their system works fine, is efficient, saves the taxpayers minting costs, and is easy to use. Let's go, America.
34 minutes ago
42 minutes ago
56 minutes ago
If these coins are costing more to make them than their actual face value, why don't the government put them out of circulation by replacing them for much cheaper material, melt the old ones and sell those metals to foreign markets to inject money into the country or re-use these melted down metals here in any industry where they might be needed to?
58 minutes ago
If we truly want to save money...let's get rid of coins completely. If we are only hanging on to coins to use in vending machines and stuff our kid's piggy bank, then let's move on! When was the last time you were even able to get anything from a vending machine that cost less than a $1? Rounding is the way to go. Besides, most of the vending machines are now being upgraded to use a debit/credit card anyway. These are the simple things we can do as a country to truly cut costs and it would be the first realistic thing that we could count on to save taxpayer dollars, unlike the wild ideas so many politicians come up w/ to get re-elected. I'll throw in one more idea that is a simple one we could count on while I am on a roll. Flat rate taxes...BTW - Happy Tax Day! Like many other hard working American's, I waited until today to file because I had to pay again this year. If we had "Flat Rate" taxes, we wouldn't even have to file. A simple 15% could be pulled from our checks each payday and we would be done (no more Tax Day!). Then we could close down the IRS and actually realize that savings as well...I think I just cut the American debt by at least 10% annually w/ two ideas, which have been around for a long time, I'm just bringing them up again :)
1 hour ago
it would be more logical to change the system like Japan's where taxes are included in all advertised, stickered, (signage ) price. Then make a lot less pennies. If a pack of cigarettes costs 3.50 (with tax) everywhere like in japan, then you only have to carry 1 dollar coins and 50 cent coins. The 1 yen coin exists but the frequency of which you should need it would be reduced significantly. Plus its really easy to budget when out shopping and you know your spending limit.
but the IDEAL solution would of course be for you to get out there (RIGHT NOW!) and buy yourself some silver dollars. Economy equals = supply and demand. If the people demand that we want to use a commodity based currency instead of they money they print from thin air, they will have no choice but to produce more silver coins , actually helping the American economy and not the elite Federal reserve and their minions (banks)
but the IDEAL solution would of course be for you to get out there (RIGHT NOW!) and buy yourself some silver dollars. Economy equals = supply and demand. If the people demand that we want to use a commodity based currency instead of they money they print from thin air, they will have no choice but to produce more silver coins , actually helping the American economy and not the elite Federal reserve and their minions (banks)
1 hour ago
1 hour ago
"We could save taxpayers an estimated $433 million over 10 years in production if we moved to using steel instead of nickel and copper in nickels and pennies," Stivers says. "Plus, the U.S. could see a $4 billion profit from recovering the nickel, zinc and copper from old coins currently in circulation."
So based on the 300 million populus the government would save the people approx .14 per person over 10 years! Thats awesome!!!! Ok so lets say theres only 10 million actual tax paying citicenz...that still only $4.33 each over 10 years! Thanks for the 2 cups of coffee and maybe a stale danish!
Last time I checked it costs money to melt down scrap metals too. It also cost money to transport these coins/metals as well (factored in?) So first we paid more for the foreign metals...Then we minted the coins and this cost us more than twice the actual face value of the coins. Now we recollect the coins and pay to melt them down and then we sell the harvested metals at I assume a higher rate than what we paid for the original metals because of current prices. However, how many pre '83 pennies are the gov going to collect as opposed to plated post '83's? Also, if it cost us double to make the coins and then an additional cost to melt them down/processing....how is this a profit? We are just getting back a portion of what we are actually spending or have already spent! Am I just stating the obvious or is my thinking way off?
So based on the 300 million populus the government would save the people approx .14 per person over 10 years! Thats awesome!!!! Ok so lets say theres only 10 million actual tax paying citicenz...that still only $4.33 each over 10 years! Thanks for the 2 cups of coffee and maybe a stale danish!
Last time I checked it costs money to melt down scrap metals too. It also cost money to transport these coins/metals as well (factored in?) So first we paid more for the foreign metals...Then we minted the coins and this cost us more than twice the actual face value of the coins. Now we recollect the coins and pay to melt them down and then we sell the harvested metals at I assume a higher rate than what we paid for the original metals because of current prices. However, how many pre '83 pennies are the gov going to collect as opposed to plated post '83's? Also, if it cost us double to make the coins and then an additional cost to melt them down/processing....how is this a profit? We are just getting back a portion of what we are actually spending or have already spent! Am I just stating the obvious or is my thinking way off?
1 hour ago
billy Bob
Our money (coins and paper bill) has no value. The coins are no longer made of silver after that year(1964). And the paper notes were once backed either by gold or by silver. not any longer. Read the bills they now say this,: this note is legal tender for all debts private and public. Pretty soon there will be no country that will accept our money because of the devaluation of our money
Our money (coins and paper bill) has no value. The coins are no longer made of silver after that year(1964). And the paper notes were once backed either by gold or by silver. not any longer. Read the bills they now say this,: this note is legal tender for all debts private and public. Pretty soon there will be no country that will accept our money because of the devaluation of our money
1 hour ago
We need to cut the penny for good and move to the $1 coin (Let's stick with the already mass-made Sacajawea dollar)
It's not going to kill business to round down to the nearest nickel for consumers. And no, it wont effect tax rates, because businesses will round down the prices or purchases individually. We can still have 3% taxes and go to the nearest 5 cent increments just fine.
1 hour ago
1 hour ago
2 hours ago
Actually I disagree. The $1 note will still be the more circulated note. The $5, $10 and $20 notes find themselves circulated about 3 times less than $1 notes. Perhaps if $5 notes were more circulated the $1 wouldn't be as much.
And I seriously doubt the cost of transportation would be that prohibitive, considering the lifespan of coins. Remember, nickels, dines and quarters are also transported. I suspect a dollar coin would make very little difference.
And I seriously doubt the cost of transportation would be that prohibitive, considering the lifespan of coins. Remember, nickels, dines and quarters are also transported. I suspect a dollar coin would make very little difference.
2 hours ago
The problem with coins comes in the cost of transportation, oddly enough by adding a $7.00 and $ 8.00 Note to the $1.00 and $5.00 we could save a lot more money by reducing the quantity of one dollar notes, and increasing the lifespan by diversifying ware between the $1.00, $5.00, $7.00, $8.00, $10.00 $20.00.
The reason this combination can work so well is partially due to the fact that 7+8=15 so these two notes will be versatile within the whole structure of numeric note system, not just between $1.00 and $5.00. Changing may purchases of low odd and even numbers to 2 and 3 notes in a wider verity of combinations.
2 hours ago
3 hours ago
3 hours ago
Oh yea, I forgot to mention, to all of us every person with a bank account.. WE ALL ARE SUCKERS!
You blame everything on the president, congress, senate.. and your mostly right..because most of them on all sides are owned bought and paid for and financed by YOU..Through the BANK! Really look at our history..it all boils down to control.. by who? The banks. they can make or break you..all the money Bill Gates has.. the banks can break him, the ruler of a country..the banks can break him, oh and on the good side the bank can make you..as long as you working for them, but oh miss a few payment.. also who else has you giving them your money for "SAFE" keeping, and charges you to use your own money? Oh yea, and they will pay you for putting your money in, and you dont use it, but will lend it to someone at a few percentage points(mostly over 6), and pay at a rate thats a min. of 1/2 percent to you? Wow! Feeling cheated yet, what about you writing a lil " get by loan" ( a check) for a day or 2, but it bounced even though you put the money in the bank to cover it..but some thing you bought caused you to over draft by $0.90, so they hit you with a OD charge of $30.00.. and guess what.. you take it, because what else can you do move your money to another bank?
So if the banks want you to get rid of the penny on the pretense of saving money LMAO, they will do it anyway, because then everything rounds out to the nearest nickle, and they can make more money! Imagine that 6 billion people times $0.05, per transaction..go figure
You blame everything on the president, congress, senate.. and your mostly right..because most of them on all sides are owned bought and paid for and financed by YOU..Through the BANK! Really look at our history..it all boils down to control.. by who? The banks. they can make or break you..all the money Bill Gates has.. the banks can break him, the ruler of a country..the banks can break him, oh and on the good side the bank can make you..as long as you working for them, but oh miss a few payment.. also who else has you giving them your money for "SAFE" keeping, and charges you to use your own money? Oh yea, and they will pay you for putting your money in, and you dont use it, but will lend it to someone at a few percentage points(mostly over 6), and pay at a rate thats a min. of 1/2 percent to you? Wow! Feeling cheated yet, what about you writing a lil " get by loan" ( a check) for a day or 2, but it bounced even though you put the money in the bank to cover it..but some thing you bought caused you to over draft by $0.90, so they hit you with a OD charge of $30.00.. and guess what.. you take it, because what else can you do move your money to another bank?
So if the banks want you to get rid of the penny on the pretense of saving money LMAO, they will do it anyway, because then everything rounds out to the nearest nickle, and they can make more money! Imagine that 6 billion people times $0.05, per transaction..go figure
3 hours ago
By law our money is supposed to be made of metals that have value not paper or not junk metals. But bankers conned stupid elected people into doing it there way! And as our money keeps devalueing, we're being robbed blind! Thanks to D.C. dummys of yesteryear and today......As the value of our dollar drops the cost or manufactureing of everything keeps going up and up and up! I used to fill up my Austin Healey Sprite 10 gallon gas tank with 100 octane gas for less than 3 bucks when my coins were stiil made of silver or copper. Today i put out 45 bucks for ten gallons of 93 octane..good job boys..devaluation of the dollar... thanks a whole lot ....
3 hours ago
3 hours ago
Rather than obsolete the penny, it's composition should be adjusted to reflect todays costs. The Treasury could very easily draw back in old pennies, that are in circulation, and melt them down. Todays penny is only .992 zinc and .008 copper. Pennies of 1959 to 1982 were .950 copper and .050 tin and zinc. Naturally there has been hoarding and exporting pennies, because of this content, which is why a law was passed to try to stem it. But it would be very easy to recoup that cost by simply withdraw any pennies that are dated during this period.
We could actually save a lot more money if we simply obsoleted the dollar bill, and replaced it with a dollar coin. 40% of all printing, that is done by the Bureau of Engaving and Printing are for $1 bills, due to the very short life of then due to being the most circulated 'green back' of all denominations. Infact we could save by creating a $2 coin, as well as a $5 coin. And the life of coins is much longer than paper money. So no, coins are not too pricey to produce.
Consider what is going to happen to the economy of the lowest paid workers in America, if the penny is abolished. The smallest denomination then will be $.05, a nickel. Consider that, when this country, until 1857, had a half cent. Where has the economy gone, where has the cost of goods gone?
But unless they were wheats, most rolls of pennies sold on EBay are memorials that are uncirculated. Circulated Memorials have very very little collector value, unless they are error coins.
If nothing else why not ressurect the $.02 piece, or the $.03 piece?
We could actually save a lot more money if we simply obsoleted the dollar bill, and replaced it with a dollar coin. 40% of all printing, that is done by the Bureau of Engaving and Printing are for $1 bills, due to the very short life of then due to being the most circulated 'green back' of all denominations. Infact we could save by creating a $2 coin, as well as a $5 coin. And the life of coins is much longer than paper money. So no, coins are not too pricey to produce.
Consider what is going to happen to the economy of the lowest paid workers in America, if the penny is abolished. The smallest denomination then will be $.05, a nickel. Consider that, when this country, until 1857, had a half cent. Where has the economy gone, where has the cost of goods gone?
But unless they were wheats, most rolls of pennies sold on EBay are memorials that are uncirculated. Circulated Memorials have very very little collector value, unless they are error coins.
If nothing else why not ressurect the $.02 piece, or the $.03 piece?
3 hours ago
Robert Moreno. I agree with you. That would be like congress regulating the value of coinage. Im all for it.
Pretty simple for me to decide what is best.
Electronic money is a disaster. Its value, Its acceptance and its very existence from day to day are not in your control. You have no say over your own value as a person.
Paper money, almost as bad. Its all promises and smiles until a penny loaf is 3.50. America is only about the 50th country in the last 200 years to be jeopardized by manipulations of this system.
Coinage of precious and semi precious metals is the only way to go. It always has SOME value at any point in time in any location. Its value is within itself, and not by promise of authority which can pass away in an instant. Coin employs people. That makes it valuable. It takes man hours to retrieve it and reflects the truest currency we will ever have. Man hours.
When we control the value of a man at a whim and reward him with promises, inflation is a certainty because people are greedy and opportunistic.
For those of you who think that the "inflation argument is stupid", consider this: When investing my aluminum quarter (should be 1/4 weight of a SILVER dollar) into Chuck E. Cheese money because it has held a more stable intrinsic value than US coinage over the last few decades..
End of line.
Pretty simple for me to decide what is best.
Electronic money is a disaster. Its value, Its acceptance and its very existence from day to day are not in your control. You have no say over your own value as a person.
Paper money, almost as bad. Its all promises and smiles until a penny loaf is 3.50. America is only about the 50th country in the last 200 years to be jeopardized by manipulations of this system.
Coinage of precious and semi precious metals is the only way to go. It always has SOME value at any point in time in any location. Its value is within itself, and not by promise of authority which can pass away in an instant. Coin employs people. That makes it valuable. It takes man hours to retrieve it and reflects the truest currency we will ever have. Man hours.
When we control the value of a man at a whim and reward him with promises, inflation is a certainty because people are greedy and opportunistic.
For those of you who think that the "inflation argument is stupid", consider this: When investing my aluminum quarter (should be 1/4 weight of a SILVER dollar) into Chuck E. Cheese money because it has held a more stable intrinsic value than US coinage over the last few decades..
End of line.
3 hours ago
lol why do we, the USA import the metals to make our own money? What metal HAS to be imported, that we can't mine in the USA? Seem to me that if we bought our own countrys metal we can save more than $433 million over 10years, plus employ our people helping with the unemployment situation and the income taxes from the mining company, and the employees will ADD to the overall US economy. Why can't they understand common sense, And for the ones who might disagree with this, because of whatever..there is always a fair answer to every business situation, now if you dont choose to follow the answer..well then you should be in politics!
3 hours ago
3 hours ago
I have read a lot of the comments, first of all, it’s not unaffordable to make pennies it’s insensible. To me the problem is easy, make a larger denomination with the material already used for the penny. Just as we all got accustomed to the one cent, we will get accustomed to whatever they decide.
4 hours ago
4 hours ago
First of all, we haven't made copper pennies since mid-1982. People have been collecting and hording the copper ones for some time now. The mint isn't going to get a bunch of them back to melt down.
The same with nickels. Check Ebay, people are buying up large quantities of nickels and pennies, and not so they can sell back to the mint for even money.
I know for a fact a lot of pennies have been melted regardless of the penalties. At one point they were worth around 3 cents each, in copper value.
People not only collect them for their melt value, but some of the doomsday crowd believes that copper pennies, copper/nickel & silver (WWII) nickels and pre-64 regular 90% silver (and of course gold and silver bullion coins) coins are the only U.S. currency that will hold value when the inflation/devaluation crap hits the fan.
The same with nickels. Check Ebay, people are buying up large quantities of nickels and pennies, and not so they can sell back to the mint for even money.
I know for a fact a lot of pennies have been melted regardless of the penalties. At one point they were worth around 3 cents each, in copper value.
People not only collect them for their melt value, but some of the doomsday crowd believes that copper pennies, copper/nickel & silver (WWII) nickels and pre-64 regular 90% silver (and of course gold and silver bullion coins) coins are the only U.S. currency that will hold value when the inflation/devaluation crap hits the fan.
4 hours ago
Hey why don't we just punch em right out of old car doors and out houses. Forget putting pictures on them, too expensive. of course you might have the problem of people counterfitting, but who cares, that's all America is worth any more. Its just monopoly money right. What our grandparents would call "funny money". But it's not that funny. A joke- yes.
4 hours ago
4 hours ago
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